can I fire both weapons

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michael01120
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can I fire both weapons

Postby michael01120 » Wed Jul 18, 2012 8:15 pm

I was looking at the dreadknight - looks like a cool thing to have in a beginners grey knight army. I was wondering if I bought the incinerator and psilencer can they both be fired at the same target in the shooting phase?

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Re: can I fire both weapons

Postby BewareOfTom » Wed Jul 18, 2012 8:23 pm

AFAIK monstrous creatures can still fire 2 weapons per shooting phase (and must be at same target)

and I'm gunna say steer clear of psilencers.... hierarchy of GK weapons is:

Psycannon > Incinerator > Psilencer

and IMHO there are no real exceptions
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Re: can I fire both weapons

Postby michael01120 » Thu Jul 19, 2012 4:24 am

I was looking at the psilencer because if I take 2 then that is 24 shots - it might be a good way to beat those pesky terminators that are sure to come into every dark angels army in the future.

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Re: can I fire both weapons

Postby Steelhalo » Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:14 am

michael01120 wrote:I was looking at the psilencer because if I take 2 then that is 24 shots - it might be a good way to beat those pesky terminators that are sure to come into every dark angels army in the future.


Nah, just ally with a faction that has demolisher cannons. :wink:

Seriously though, the best loadout would probably be Heavy Incinerator and greatsword.

Oh and I just read that you can't take 2 of the same ranged weapon.
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Re: can I fire both weapons

Postby Flak » Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:41 am

michael01120 wrote:I was looking at the psilencer because if I take 2 then that is 24 shots - it might be a good way to beat those pesky terminators that are sure to come into every dark angels army in the future.
I realize 24 shots looks appealing, but when you take into account that your wounding on 4's (usually), and have AP-, unless your versing ALOT of horde armies, a heavy psycannon (wounding on 2's, large blast, rending) or a heavy incinerator are much more effective for their higher strength and better AP value.

Let's look at the math hammer

12 shots from a single gatling psylencer.
BS4 means you need 3's to hit. Working by averages and percentages, thats about 66% hit, meaning 7-8 hits. Assuming your firing against space marines (just for example) with toughness 4, thats 4's to would. 50%. Leaving us with 3-4 wounds. Then, they get their armor save which is 3+. 66% which roughly leaves us with a single kill.

Compared to a heavy psycannon. Let's say the template doesn't scatter and the large blast hits eight out of ten marines.
The strength is 7 meaning that 2's will wound, rough 83% chance to wound, and 16% chance of that to ignore armor saves. On average out of those thats seven wounds, one of which rending, and with their 3+ armor save, 66%, that leaves us with anywhere from 3-5 dead.

Sorry I have to go so much into this, I just dont like grey knight players making mistakes like this
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Re: can I fire both weapons

Postby Steelhalo » Thu Jul 19, 2012 7:11 am

Flak wrote:
michael01120 wrote:I was looking at the psilencer because if I take 2 then that is 24 shots - it might be a good way to beat those pesky terminators that are sure to come into every dark angels army in the future.
I realize 24 shots looks appealing, but when you take into account that your wounding on 4's (usually), and have AP-, unless your versing ALOT of horde armies, a heavy psycannon (wounding on 2's, large blast, rending) or a heavy incinerator are much more effective for their higher strength and better AP value.

Let's look at the math hammer

12 shots from a single gatling psylencer.
BS4 means you need 3's to hit. Working by averages and percentages, thats about 66% hit, meaning 7-8 hits. Assuming your firing against space marines (just for example) with toughness 4, thats 4's to would. 50%. Leaving us with 3-4 wounds. Then, they get their armor save which is 3+. 66% which roughly leaves us with a single kill.

Compared to a heavy psycannon. Let's say the template doesn't scatter and the large blast hits eight out of ten marines.
The strength is 7 meaning that 2's will wound, rough 83% chance to wound, and 16% chance of that to ignore armor saves. On average out of those thats seven wounds, one of which rending, and with their 3+ armor save, 66%, that leaves us with anywhere from 3-5 dead.

Sorry I have to go so much into this, I just dont like grey knight players making mistakes like this


In summary, Gatling Silencer: good against nids, orks and not much else.
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Re: can I fire both weapons

Postby michael01120 » Thu Jul 19, 2012 8:47 am

I normally go against orks , guard and space marines. I just do not know what to take. Also someone told me that if you take the doomhammer you are not reduced to initiative 1 - is this true?

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Re: can I fire both weapons

Postby BewareOfTom » Thu Jul 19, 2012 9:22 am

no, I think MC's ignore unweildy

and IMHO this is the only setup that should be run (stuff with asterisks around them are optional):

dreadknight - teleporter, hvy incin. *hvy psycannon*, *sword*

do not take everything, make his cost WAY too much
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michael01120
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Re: can I fire both weapons

Postby michael01120 » Thu Jul 19, 2012 10:25 am

I thought if you take the teleporter then you lose the monstrous creature rules and just get the jump infantry rules ?

so what is the ideal layout for a dreadnknight ? (excluding the teleporter)

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Re: can I fire both weapons

Postby BewareOfTom » Thu Jul 19, 2012 10:28 am

what? no....

you become a jump monstrous creature....

and if you dont want a teleporter take heavy incin and heavy psycannon :P
I have half a mind to kill you, and the other half agrees

"(Lebianism) is rather inefficient... there appear to be interface problems"
- Engelbart Kappa


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michael01120
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Re: can I fire both weapons

Postby michael01120 » Thu Jul 19, 2012 11:56 am

Ok thanks :D I look forward to destroying a load of stuff with it. would you say 1 in a army is enough or is 2-3 better?

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Re: can I fire both weapons

Postby BewareOfTom » Thu Jul 19, 2012 12:03 pm

well what I'm thinking of doing eventually is 2 psyrifleman dreads and a teleporter knight with psy/incin
I have half a mind to kill you, and the other half agrees

"(Lebianism) is rather inefficient... there appear to be interface problems"
- Engelbart Kappa


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Re: can I fire both weapons

Postby MFletch » Thu Jul 19, 2012 1:20 pm

Can I recommend that you post things like this in the grey knights bit, with dreadknight in the title? You'll find it easier and quicker getting responses, hopefully :)

Dreadknights can now be targeted by meltabombs :), though admittedly that only removes one wound. But they can be targeted by krak grenades :), armies have lots of them :)


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