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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:09 am 
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We both bought the deck builders kits and were in the process of playing with each deck we can make to find what we like. I have a particular thing for blue. I wanna make a really controlly deck, but still have a great offense and defense with creatures which i had a hard time getting sufficient creatures out especially against red.

Advice for this noobie would be great :) and some suggestions on how to build a more controlling deck, thanks in advance.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:50 am 
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usually you find that it is hard to make decks with multiple uses

i.e. you will probably find it hard to make a control deck that is also a hard hitter. you really have to choose between one or the other

with a control deck, you want things that tap opponent cards, loads of counters (especially against red), and also things like mind control so when your opponent puts down a powerful creature you can say "i think ill be having that"

it is possible to make multiple skill decks, but it is usually best to have one speciallity

the best way to make a deck is too decide a concept (i.e. control) then find out all of your cards that have that are most suited for this. Then sort through those cards.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:31 am 
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I'm working on getting another mind control so I have the max of four and a few more ice cages. What kind of creatures would I want in a control deck? Like a bunch with scry so I can basically have power over what I want to draw?

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:59 am 
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creatures with scry might be good. Also have a look at soul seizer, its a 1/3 spirit, but when it deals damage to a player, you can transform it, enchant a creature that player controls and you control it, its basically a mind control, but it comes down as a creature and you have to deal damage to the player first

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 4:56 pm 
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I have run a Ludwigs Test subject (I know i have spelt that wrong lol) in my control deck and just stalled my way to victory. I have also just ran a low cost human blue/white deck, basically 1 or 2 drop humans and a whole deck of cancels, negates and such.

But yeah if your aiming to control with your deck, build it to control. Semi control decks are really hard to use well when starting the game. But have faith in your controlling power.

The other thing cards from the deck builder might not give you a super strong control deck off the bat, so look around maybe grab some cheap singles here and there and build that blue deck of win. Generally speaking bad creature decks are better than bad spell decks, so if you guys aren't experience in making your decks this may be the case, but dont be turned off. just keep building and looking at other decks for ideas. it wont take long for you to get good man.

GL and feel free to PM me about anything magic related :)

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 6:11 pm 
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you did spell ludwigs test subject correctly

the problem with ludwigs test subject is, once youve played it once...then your opponent knows what it can do, then from then on, they will do everything in their power to stop it, exiles, lightning bolts

ive seen ludwigs in a control deck and they have managed to do well

the guy had 4 of them in his deck, he used a swiftfoot boots and made it hexproof, eventually he managed to get it up to the required number of counters to transform it. He then played levitation, so it was flying. Next turn he played cackling counterpart, and then put swiftfoot boots onto that.....meaning that he then attacked me with 2 flying 13/13 ludwigs abominations......yeah you can guess how long i survived after that

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 6:43 pm 
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Korsarro-Khan wrote:
you did spell ludwigs test subject correctly

the problem with ludwigs test subject is, once youve played it once...then your opponent knows what it can do, then from then on, they will do everything in their power to stop it, exiles, lightning bolts

ive seen ludwigs in a control deck and they have managed to do well

the guy had 4 of them in his deck, he used a swiftfoot boots and made it hexproof, eventually he managed to get it up to the required number of counters to transform it. He then played levitation, so it was flying. Next turn he played cackling counterpart, and then put swiftfoot boots onto that.....meaning that he then attacked me with 2 flying 13/13 ludwigs abominations......yeah you can guess how long i survived after that

Would of given it island walk yeah? And that sounds very similar to my control deck, i have 2 storm tide leviathans 3 ludwigs (girlfriend lost one...sigh) and an inkwell leviathan, the rest is counter's cancels negates and so forth. few snapcasters.

The hand thing is if you buy a booster from any of the last couple sets your more than likely to get an artifact/enchant that will give a creature hex, so it works pretty well. but then again it comes down to what exactly you want to accomplish with your deck.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 10:27 pm 
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I prefer blue/black over Pure blue for control, as it gives you more options.

Here is a few cards to keep your eye out for in packs, or trades (if your lucky!)

Blue:
Snapcaster: Absolutly great for control, lets you recycle the counter spells for additional uses, and later on can be an easy trigger for morbid!

Consecrated Spinx: Another Great card for control, it gives you the card advantage very easily, allowing you to have more cards, and therefor more options of what to cast. Generally a high mana cost, but well worth it.

Think Twice: A relatively Cheap Card draw, the best part is you can do it twice! Card advantage is wonderful!

Mana Leak: your staple Counterspell

Dissipate: The better counterspell, preferably used against cards with flashback, or against cards that your opponent can replay/reuse in graveyard


Black:

Lilliana of the Veil: Once More card advantage, all of her abilities are great for a Control Deck!

Bloodgift Demon: Another Card advantage creature, and a decent power/toughness as well.

Black Sun's Zenith: Reusable mass AOE? wonderful early game to control the field, and.. well its viable late game if your opponent is ahead of you. Don't be too worried about losing creatures, with enough of a card advantage and time, you should have 1-2 creatures on the field at a time... and for them, maybe less.

Curse of Death's Hold: Deals with all your opponent's 1/1s automatically, and weakens the rest for the duration of the game? Easy trigger for morbid too.

Go for the Throat: Kills non artifacts easy, control of the field is great!
Doomblade: Same as Go for the Throat, except its against Non black
Tribute to Hunger: Forces your opponent to sac a creature, which is great if they only have a single big scary guy on the field, if played right means you can kill the hexproof scary creature every time.
Tragic slip:
This card is overpowered if morbid is active, as it means you can kill ANY creature in the meta(non hexproof that is for 1 black.

late game, its awesome to snapcaster, target tragic slip, block a 1st strike creature, kill a the real threat with the slip, For... 3 mana.


Combine the above with duel land and you get a pretty powerful (though expensive) blue/black control deck, with good power against creatures, and the ability to laugh at most other creature based decks.

lands wide, Drown yards are great as an alternate win condition, since your options are now Mill and kill!

-None

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 7:01 pm 
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Dont over look spell books as well if your going for card advantage, first turn drop and then drawing cards all day. SO FUN.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 3:40 pm 
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Spell book does not give any card advantage.

For example, a card that destroys two creatures gives you card advantage.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 5:28 pm 
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Card Advantage basically implys you are no longer top-decking (or drawing a reaction) to win. its the ability to use your deck faster, via having a Card-Draw Advantage over your opponent.

A Card that destroys two creatures is an example of mana Efficiency.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 2:13 am 
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Sorry but you got it wrong.

"The basic concept of card advantage is one player having more cards in hand and in play than their opponent. Card advantage is generally indicated in terms of a positive number - if a player casts Ancestral Recall, a spell that causes a player to draw 3 cards, that player is said to have gained +2 card advantage (he gains three cards - the ones he drew - while losing one - the Ancestral Recall itself). It is also often stated in terms of X-for-Y, where X and Y are numbers. If a player plays Plague Wind, a card which destroys all enemy creatures in play, when they themselves have no creatures in play and their opponent has two creatures in play, they are said to have gotten a "2-for-1", where 2 indicates the number of opposing cards removed from play and 1 indicates the card spent in order to accomplish this task." Wikki

And unless you have a deck that revolves around drawing loads of cards, spellbook is a deadcard and does not do a whole lot.

For the players who are building a new deck it is important to take a good look at CA, but also to take a good look at your mana curve.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 10:40 pm 
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if you aren't playing standard and just random fun cards something you can look at is mass polymorph. The general idea is you load you deck with counter spells, card drawing/library manipulation like Forbidden Alchemy, preordains and such. Then you have cards that make creatures like lands that give you an 0/1 or 1/1 when they come into play. Finally you play mass polymorph and throw in like 3-4 big hitters like Emrakul, darksteel colossus. Its fun because you get to control the tempo of the game and you get to toy around with the big boys. Will it win you tournaments? probably not, will you have loads of fun with it? you most certainly will.

I do agree that blue/black is a fun way to go if you really want to control the game. You have your counter spells like mana leak, spellsteal etc and you have your destruction doomblade, go for the throat etc. One of the better man lands in Creeping tar pit, snapcaster mage to get spells back when needed. Preordain/Ponder to manipulate your library. And if you feel really generous you can buy a Jace, the mind sculptor to really have fun.


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