strike from the shadows

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horus-wm
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strike from the shadows

Post by horus-wm » Tue Apr 24, 2018 3:24 pm

Hi, quick question about the Raven Guard stratagem Strike from the Shadows me and a friend had while seeing how much cheese we can ram into one army just for the hell of it. If you have say 3 squads of hell blasters strike form the shadows would they be considered on the field for the purpose of power level quotas? I know in the new FAQ it states that those stratagems aren't restricted like a normal unit deepstriking is now but my friend wanted to have some clarification if the units striking form the shadows power level would be represented as already on the field. I would make the argument that the power level would count as being on the field since the wording of the stratagem is they're placed before the first turn begins but he's worried that it may be illegal since they weren't placed during deployment. Any help is always greatly appreciated!

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Re: strike from the shadows

Post by mrazek22 » Tue Apr 24, 2018 3:47 pm

All models on your list must be factored into points total. If they are in an ether or a teleportarium, or a transport, or a gunship, or under the ground, or in the pipes, or anywhere that can enter the field, you must count them as points. You can't put units in play that you didn't pay for.

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Re: strike from the shadows

Post by horus-wm » Tue Apr 24, 2018 3:59 pm

I'm sorry for the confusion on this. What I meant was as per the new tactical reserves half of your armies power level must be on the field instead of the number of units in your army. My question is would the units using the stratagem Strike from the shadows be considered on the field for the purpose of counting your armies power level. I say it would count as them being on the field because it forces them to be there before the first turn begins.

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Re: strike from the shadows

Post by horus-wm » Tue Apr 24, 2018 4:00 pm

Also would the Tallarn guardsmen stratagem operate like the Strike from the shadows in that it is exempt from the restrictions?

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Re: strike from the shadows

Post by mrazek22 » Tue Apr 24, 2018 4:23 pm

So wait, are you asking if it's not on the field, can you count it like it's on the field? I think I must still be confused. If it's not on the field, you can't count it as on the field. ANYTHING that is not physically on the field, first turn, is not counted as on the field.

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Re: strike from the shadows

Post by Koonitz » Tue Apr 24, 2018 5:12 pm

mrazek22 wrote:
Tue Apr 24, 2018 4:23 pm
So wait, are you asking if it's not on the field, can you count it like it's on the field? I think I must still be confused. If it's not on the field, you can't count it as on the field. ANYTHING that is not physically on the field, first turn, is not counted as on the field.
Problem is, the stratagem says to deploy them after the armies are deployed but BEFORE you take the first turn. Thus, on the first turn, they ARE on the board.

However, I would argue that you decide what you can put in "deep strike" reserves during deployment, where they ARE held off the board, therefore should count. I don't have my codex to read the specific wording, however.

This is also why this particular stratagem is exempt from the first turn "only deploy in your deployment zone" beta rule.
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Re: strike from the shadows

Post by mrazek22 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:53 am

If my interpretation is correct, then I would say that they are stating these must be in reserve, or not on the board. "...deploy them after the army is deployed..." sounds to me like it's saying it's a separate deployment, IE Teleporter. I think they are like Scions in high orbit, but they can 1st turn DS into enemy lands, where Scions can't.

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Re: strike from the shadows

Post by Mach-Ten » Wed Apr 25, 2018 9:52 am

mrazek22 wrote:
Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:53 am
If my interpretation is correct, then I would say that they are stating these must be in reserve, or not on the board. "...deploy them after the army is deployed..." sounds to me like it's saying it's a separate deployment, IE Teleporter. I think they are like Scions in high orbit, but they can 1st turn DS into enemy lands, where Scions can't.
had to read it several times in the FAQ before agreeing here..

GW specifically exempt STFS for the deployment zones when setting them up in the first turn BUT ...the majority of the rule counts in Deployment.

so yeah Raven guard shadow strikers must count with deepstrikers and other reserves as 1/2 you PL and half your army.

Sucks but there it is.

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Re: strike from the shadows

Post by Ronin » Wed Apr 25, 2018 11:22 am

Can't you only use the stratagem on one unit, though?

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Re: strike from the shadows

Post by mrazek22 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 11:47 am

I love how FAQs, whose created purpose is to relieve confusion, cause greater confusion. They could make a billion dollars a day offering a 24/7 call in service like the Old Nintendo Power used to do.

"Hello, welcome to GW Rules Lawyers, how can we address your confusion?"
"I don't understand the deep strike faq. Can I use "X" unit in "Y" way?"
"Only if you first have these conditions met"
"But that isn't in the faq"
"Yes but it's in CA 2 and the updated Rules faq 2017."
"I don't understand...."
"That will be 37.50, or do you wish to ask a further question of our staff?"

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Re: strike from the shadows

Post by Mach-Ten » Thu Apr 26, 2018 4:43 am

Ronin wrote:
Wed Apr 25, 2018 11:22 am
Can't you only use the stratagem on one unit, though?
no, as it's pre game they added an FAQ to say it can be used as much as you want within restrictions.

and also if you have a way to regen CP on a dice roll, then that does not apply as the game has not begun then your warlord needs to have been deployed onto the table to get those CP back when you spend them

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Re: strike from the shadows

Post by Ronin » Thu Apr 26, 2018 7:55 am

That doesn't sound right. What about stratagems like the webway ones that defines how many units you can put in deep strike? Couldn't you just spam that one since it's pre game?

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Re: strike from the shadows

Post by Koonitz » Thu Apr 26, 2018 10:09 am

Ronin wrote:
Thu Apr 26, 2018 7:55 am
That doesn't sound right. What about stratagems like the webway ones that defines how many units you can put in deep strike? Couldn't you just spam that one since it's pre game?
Both the Eldar and Thousand Sons version states it may only be used once per battle.
Armies:
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30k: Thousand Sons
Age of Sigmar: Sylvaneth, Disciples of Tzeentch

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