Wolfkin Rules Question

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Xlv7
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Wolfkin Rules Question

Post by Xlv7 » Mon May 15, 2017 10:29 am

Hey Guys

My friend has built a 30k space wolves army that is spearheaded by Russ and the two wolf brothers. Now in the Wolfkin Rules it states that they must start within 6 inches of russ but form a different unit similar to the dreadnought talon rules. However this is where the rules get tricky. The goal for the army is to have Russ in a Spartan with a unit of Wolf Guard terminators. The Wolfkin rules state that if Russ starts in a transport then they must also start the game in the same transport. However they are not independent characters so can you have Russ Wolfkin and Wolfguard rolling in a spartan at the same time. Technically that is two units in the same transport but im wondering if russ's independent character grandfathers them into the transport and then they become a separate unit once they have disembarked. There is enough transport capacity for this but the rules are very unclear. They are very clear once out on the battlefield but not within the transports. The main reason we ask is A.) we wanna get the rules right and B.) this is pretty much the only sound strategy to field these units and we will need to retool army lists if this isnt legal.
Im wondering

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Koonitz
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Re: Wolfkin Rules Question

Post by Koonitz » Mon May 15, 2017 12:38 pm

I would say that if the rules specifically state they must start in the same transport, this would bypass the normal restriction of only having one unit in the transport at any given time. This is similar to two separate rules that do the same thing:

1) Space Marine Combat squads. Two separate squads able to ride the same transport.

2) Super-heavy transports. Capable of bearing as many units as possible, so long as total transport capacity is not exceeded. Even though the Spartan isn't really a super-heavy.

I'd allow them in a Spartan unless there were further rules elsewhere to state otherwise.
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30k: Thousand Sons
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Xlv7
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Re: Wolfkin Rules Question

Post by Xlv7 » Mon May 15, 2017 6:03 pm

That's the basic assumption that we where operating off of. However we see it at one of those areas where an opponent could get a tad disgruntled when Leman Russ wolf guard and two ginormous wolves are unleashed in what could be seen as a shaky rule set

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Koonitz
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Re: Wolfkin Rules Question

Post by Koonitz » Mon May 15, 2017 6:28 pm

Xlv7 wrote:That's the basic assumption that we where operating off of. However we see it at one of those areas where an opponent could get a tad disgruntled when Leman Russ wolf guard and two ginormous wolves are unleashed in what could be seen as a shaky rule set
My apologies. I forgot of a third example, which may end up being a closer example to what we currently have. Though it may not fit the framework of transports, it fits the framework of a multi-model unit with an IC being able to join another unit.

Tau Commanders with drones. Despite being a unit of 2-3 models, the Commander is still able to join another unit, where the drones, like the IC, become part of the unit. In this sense, this unit would then be able to embark upon a transport as if they were one unit.

Similiar in concept to Leman Russ and his Wolfkin. Though they still act independently.

The only other option you would have would be to write to Forge World, but I don't see a problem with it, at all.
Armies:
40k: Knights Cynosure Iron Hands successor chapter, House Terryn Questor Imperialis, Thousand Sons/Tzeentch Daemons
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Xlv7
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Re: Wolfkin Rules Question

Post by Xlv7 » Mon May 15, 2017 9:47 pm

That was the logic that we where playing by. It also works fluff wise with Russ and his brothers riding in some transport. The ramp drops down and two massive wolves burst out followed by Russ and his honor guard. However the rules are a fickle thing sometimes and it always healthy to double check when unsure.

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Re: Wolfkin Rules Question

Post by Koonitz » Mon May 15, 2017 10:05 pm

Now that I am home with my book out:
They must be deployed within 6" of Leman Russ at the start of the game (or if Leman Russ begins the game in Reserve or on board a transport, they must be with him, and may be transported in a vehicle so long as Leman Russ is also being transported). Once deployed, however, each Wolf is treated as an entirely separate unit which cannot join other units, except... <Look out, Sir! bonus>
This very specifically worded statement tells me that, during deployment, this rule allows you to ignore all previous restrictions on transports (excepting transport capacity) to allow them to be embarked with Leman Russ, even though they count as a separate unit. There is no question of this whatsoever in my mind.

HOWEVER! Once the game begins, they count as a separate unit, so the moment you disembark with them, they are a separate unit and may no longer embark on a transport with any other unit, even if that unit is Leman Russ.
Armies:
40k: Knights Cynosure Iron Hands successor chapter, House Terryn Questor Imperialis, Thousand Sons/Tzeentch Daemons
30k: Thousand Sons
Age of Sigmar: Sylvaneth, Disciples of Tzeentch

Xlv7
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Re: Wolfkin Rules Question

Post by Xlv7 » Wed May 17, 2017 9:12 pm

I completely agree with your logic. It also makes the wolfkin worth taking. Those wolves are really good in assault like surprisingly good. However considering that their save are terrible they will generally never make it there. Spartan born wolfkin will be rather nasty.

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