Assault D3

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Koonitz
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Re: Assault D3

Post by Koonitz » Mon Jan 04, 2016 12:32 am

I can honestly say I do not have a rebuttal to that argument.

However, I can also say that I, and my friends, will not be altering how we use these weapons without evidence from GW that we are doing it wrong (yes, that means a frag missile firing launcher can then overwatch krak).

I'm sorry, but I'm not willing to render that many weapons (those with both ranged and melee profiles) completely useless. Up to and including one entire Knight, the Lancer, whose only ranged weapon is a dual profile with its D-lance melee weapon. I have a hard enough time wanting to field it now as it is the weakest of the Forge World Knights. I'd never field it if firing it's ranged weapon means losing it's d-melee weapon.
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Re: Assault D3

Post by Arnathos » Mon Jan 04, 2016 5:12 am

It is true that the implications are far reaching, I do find the ETC FAQ fair which says ylu can choose each phase rather than each turn, so pistols won't be totally useless.

I hope we get an FAQ someday.
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Re: Assault D3

Post by psychoticbuzzsaw » Tue Jan 19, 2016 7:28 pm

Arnathos wrote:So what your saying is, if I fire a Blastmaster I can choose to use both the varied and single frequency? Because if I can choose to use both profiles in the same turn, then I must use all of them as the same page (41) says that when a model fires their weapon they must do so to full effect.

Missile launchers use the exact same wording as on page 41 btw, so when it tells me that everytime I fire my missile launcher I may choose which type of missile to use I can say all of them? Actually I have to say all of them, because, you know, full effect when firing etc. Although if you go with my interpretation the added rules make sense, as they specify you choose each time it fires, not each turn.

I will give you that this is a debated issue:Warseer Dakka Dakka.

The way we play it around here is that you need to choose one each turn. This also means that if I would fire interceptor with a blastmaster using single frequency and would get assaulted that turn, it would not be able to fire using varied frequency in overwatch. A missile launcher would be able to interceptor with a frag missile and overwatch using a krak missile, because it gets to choose each time it fires.

It would be interesting to see how the rules are worded in the French, German and Spanish versions of the rules, as they are sometimes more consistent(but sometimes totally different as well).

The ETC FAQ for 2016 rules that you choose once each phase, rather than once each turn and seems to agree that pistols have 2 profiles.

I have never seen nor played with this sort of rules twisting. Of course you can only fire one profile at a time, but if its a melee weapon with a shooting profile you can use it to shoot in the shooting phase and hit stuff in CC in the same turn. When did this become an issue btw.

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Re: Assault D3

Post by Arnathos » Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:15 am

Well it tells you to choose which profile to use each turn on the page mentioned previously. It is the same wording which limits shooting weapons with multiple profiles. Now each profile counts as a different weapon for shooting, so infantry can only shoot 1 profile regardless, but monstrous creatures and vehicles would become quite crazy.

Also if the ETC FAQ's it to let you choose each phase rather than each turn, I can't be the only one who read these rules?

Just read through the topics I linked etc. It is hardly twisting the rules as in so many cases they are unclear and there doesn't seem there is an exception for melee weapons as you just said, if there is, please give me a page number and paragraph that states melee weapons with multiple profiles are different from weapons with only shooting profiles when it comes to multiple profiles.

EDIT:

For reference the paragraph which caused a lot of hassle(key terms in bold):
Some weapons can be used in different ways, representing different power settings or types of ammo. Some weapons can be used in combat as well as shooting. Where this is the case, there will be a separate line in the weapon's profile for each, and you can choose which to use each turn.
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Re: Assault D3

Post by Kovlovsky » Wed Jan 20, 2016 12:10 pm

I think there is a moment where you must go beyond the comfort of RaW and house rule it for good of the game. It doesn't make any sense that you can't use a close combat weapon if you just used its shooting profile to fire in the same turn. If it doesn't tell you directly that you can't in this particular weapon rules, I would absolutely allow a player to shoot and then fight in close combat with the relevant profile. Warhammer 40k rules aren't tight enough to allow someone to go for RaW interpretations rigidly and against any sense of logic.
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Re: Assault D3

Post by Arnathos » Wed Jan 20, 2016 2:23 pm

You have the french rules right? I'm interested to see how they word it!
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Kovlovsky
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Re: Assault D3

Post by Kovlovsky » Wed Jan 20, 2016 2:25 pm

Arnathos wrote:You have the french rules right? I'm interested to see how they word it!
Unfortunately not. When I bought DV in the 6th, the French version of the box was out of production for Canada. :( Then, in the 7th edition, I bought the small rule book on Ebay and only found it in english... I'm sorry to disappoint. My CSM codex is in French however.
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Re: Assault D3

Post by Chopian » Tue Apr 11, 2017 6:44 am

For people finding this thread looking for answers:

As of January 2017 Games Workshop has released official Rules Errata/FAQ (source https://www.games-workshop.com/en-DK/Ru ... d=11278574 )

In the Necron FAQ it states:
Q: Can a Triarch Praetorian fire with its rod of covenant in the
Shooting phase, and still use its melee profile in the subsequent
Assault phase?
A: Yes.

I would assume that similar FAQs are written for the other weapons in question.

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Re: Assault D3

Post by Koonitz » Tue Apr 11, 2017 10:12 am

Please make sure you are aware of forum rules when posting. This thread is well over a year old. If anyone was still interested in this answer, they likely would have already found it, or could make a new post.
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