Rumour round up.

Talk about all the armies of the Imperium here, from the mighty Space Marines to the innumerable Astra Militarum.
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Re: Rumour round up.

Post by Arnathos » Fri Apr 11, 2014 12:10 pm

Well mostly everything makes a lot more sense point cost wise for this edition and has been optimized. Army wide special rules are basically just orders, which didn't change much, even get back in the fight in there(although you don't get to move 3'' after rallying, possibly to prevent abuse with the Marneus Calgar relic).

Veterans got cheaper, chimera's got more expensive by the same amount.

Ogryns are now very bulky(IIRC they where only bulky before) and I'm not seeing them being useful just yet.

Ratlings can now run after shooting, and stayed at the same points cost, there is an item which gives you inspired tactics on any doubles(all orders after inspired tactics auto succeed) which can be used to give them ignores cover. Ratlings were already an auto-include for me and they just got better.

Tech priests lost the extra attack from the servo arm, but it is AP1 now and can give a single vehicle within 12" Power of the CheatersMachine Spirit.

You can't spam 5 commissars in a blob anymore, but you can give every commissar a power fist!

There is a ton of stuff really and I love it already :D
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Re: Rumour round up.

Post by warmaster40k » Fri Apr 11, 2014 2:20 pm

Oh just spoil it, everything! I gotsta know! lol
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Re: Rumour round up.

Post by coldsteel » Fri Apr 11, 2014 7:35 pm

Vets still get 3 special weapons.
Crucifiers (SM codex) (11881/703 PL)
Orks (3745/255 PL)
Astra Militarum (####/378 PL)
Fallen Crucifiers (CSM codex) (####/351 PL)
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Primaris Marines (1099/60 PL)

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Re: Rumour round up.

Post by Arnathos » Sat Apr 12, 2014 2:43 am

They do and all the doctrines are cheaper, except for demolitions but seeing as a demo charge is 2 ratlings you are only paying 1 point per model for meltabombs, which is always awesome. Forward sentries dropped 66% in price and grenadiers went down by 50%.

Death strike missle is now an apocalyptic blast (taking the average of the previous 3+D3 inches radius) still S10 AP1 ignores cover ordnance barrage, don't recall if it went up or down in cost or stayed the same.

Will have a more detailed list later today.
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Re: Rumour round up.

Post by IGfanatic » Sat Apr 12, 2014 1:00 pm

Is the medi-pack an option worth considering now?
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Re: Rumour round up.

Post by BunkhouseBuster » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:36 pm

A Medi-pack costs as much as a Plasma gun, so it got cheaper. Put that in a squad with Straken and have some fun.
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Re: Rumour round up.

Post by The Airman » Sun Apr 13, 2014 4:22 am

It really sucks you have to buy weapons for Heavy Weapons Squads as well as Special Weapons Squads. It makes sense, but it's too expensive.
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Re: Rumour round up.

Post by Arnathos » Sun Apr 13, 2014 6:36 am

Heavy weapon squads are the exact same point cost as they were before and special weapon squads actually got 5 points cheaper. They have no additional options or anything, except for the flakk missiles on heavy weapon squads for the usual overpriced cost.

If anyone was wondering about the russes, in addition to most variants becoming significantly cheaper, all sponsons went down 10 points and the hull mounted lascannon went down by 5.

Hydra's are 5 points cheaper, but no longer ignore jink, so pretty useless unless you are in a flyer/xenos heavy meta.

Manticore went up 10 points, but otherwise stayed the same.

Deathstrike, as previously mentioned, now has a 10" blast marker(apocalyptic blast) but still ignores cover and is still S10 AP1.

Camo netting went down 5 points, but now gives +1 to cover saves rather than stealth, so you will need to upgrade all models in a unit, not just one. :(



As for Fast attack

Vendetta and valkyrie both got more expensive and vendetta lost half its transport capacity, pretty much as the rumors said.

Hellhound squadrons got a few point changes, hull mounted multimelta's are 10 points cheaper, the hellhound is 5 points cheaper, the devil dog is 15 points more expensive(Emperor knows why, possibly the changes to blast weapons vs vehicles this edition, but I've never seen people use these before, so I doubt we will see them now). The Bane Wolf stayed the same points cost wise.

Rough riders are still in, but were heavily nerfed, going up 1 point per model and their hunting lances are now specialist weapons, meaning they only get 2 attacks on the charge, rather than the previous 3. Mogul Kamir is gone.

Armoured sentinels are as per the preview, so tons cheaper.

Scout sentinels stayed the same, but most weapon options got 5 points cheaper, its not much, but then they were borderline overpowered before.


Then onto elites:

Tempestus platoons are exactly as per WD

Psyker battle squads are now Wyrdvane psykers, going down 1 point of Ld and up 2 points per model. They no longer have an overseer and are a brotherhood of psykers that can generate powers from Biomancy, divination, Pyromancy and telekinesis.

Ratlings stayed the same, but can now run after shooting, so an auto include unit.

Ogryns and Bullgryns as per WD

Marbo is gone


Dedicated trannsports:

Taurox(prime) as per WD

Chimera +10 points, but most vehicle equipment got cheaper. But can only let 2 models fire from the top hatch(or 1 weapon team). The lasguns arrays are now a weapon that can always fire at full ballistic skill even if the chimera moved 12"(but not if shaken or stunned) and each set of 3 can fire at a different target than the chimera itself or the occupants.

It is also worth mentioning that most vehicle equipment went down in cost by 5 points on almost everything, and there is now a 25 point homing beacon for vehicles, which any vehicle can take.





There is tons more, but I'll have to type it out later.
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Re: Rumour round up.

Post by IGfanatic » Sun Apr 13, 2014 12:49 pm

Thanks for taking the time to do that for us! I can't wait to get mine now!
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Re: Rumour round up.

Post by Arnathos » Sun Apr 13, 2014 1:54 pm

No probs Iggy! And this is an awesome codex. Now on to troops:

Chenkov and Bastonne are gone, but Harker is still there, albeit demoted to the rank of sergeant(from gunnery Sergeant) and he no longer gives stealth to his unit, but still prevents you from taking the grenadiers doctrine.

Vets as previously mentioned got cheaper, as did the heavy flamer and most of their doctrines(save for demolitions, but its balanced cost wise internally).

The biggest changes to platoons are that you can no longer give 5 commissars to a single squad, conscripts are down 1 point a model, special weapon squads are 5 points cheaper and the rules no longer mention the platoon arriving collectively from reserves.

Other than that the changes are minor, like how codex wide sergeants and characters lost the ability to take 2 plasma pistols or 2 power fists/weapons, or 2 pistols of any kind.

Penal legion is indeed gone, so veterans and platoons are our only troop choices. I was hoping for armoured fist squads replacing veterans, but alas, it was not to be.


As for the HQ section:

Company command squads went up 10 points, but got awesome orders, carapace armour for the whole squad is 7 points cheaper, medipack is halved in cost, most other options stayed the same, except for the fact that the officer of the fleet ability is now an order, but he can also give a bonus to reserve rolls(This stacks with multiples, for extreme trolling when you roll the -1 to reserves warlord trait from the BRB). The Astropath is now a mere level 1 telepath.

The company standard is cheaper, but still 5-10 points too expensive in my opinion.



Tank Commanders seem solid, for the cost of a doctrine they give a russ of your choice BS4, but must take a 2nd russ in their squadron, the rules are a bit iffy, but basically this should allow you to take leman russ squadrons in your HQ slot instead of heavy support, opening up those precious slots.


The Lord commissar is still a BAMF even though a fist will cost you 10 points more than before, he went down 5 points though, so its only a slight increase. He still has his abilities, but cannot be your warlord if you also have a senior officer(CCS/creed/straken).

Straken seems fun, they changed his rules around a bit, but he should still be able to punch holes in land raiders and monoliths like nobodies business.

Creed has been hit with the nerf bat as he now has to roll and see if he can outflank units, but gets 2 warlord traits, he went down 10 points. Kell got worse, as he uses his leadership now, instead of creeds, but got 10 points cheaper.

Yarrick is pretty much the same as he was before, just 40 points cheaper. He automatically gets the warlord trait that makes units within 12" not have to take moral tests for losing 25% of their number in a single phase.
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Re: Rumour round up.

Post by Herminator » Sun Apr 13, 2014 7:33 pm

Here's a couple of ideas from the codexes new gimmicks

Tank commander Pask with a gatling cannon Russ, has rending and re-rolls vs vehicules, add in a little prescience and you're re-rolling everything on him. Statistically that's a squad of marines or a MC down each turn, not talking about vehicules and squadrons. Give him two bareback Russes as cover and always split fire to battle cannon other things. Power unit here....

Put three blobs of 50 infantry/conscripts in a list with priests in there, makes for large hatred/fearless units, not even pask can take down such a squad, had in krak nades and go crazy on everything. 50 conscripts with prescience and more fire order and you've got AT LEAST 100 shots that re-roll to hit.... not bad for 3 pt models.

This codex does not need to ally around to get things done, but all battle brother codexes could get really cheap fearless and prescience units for a low cost. Oh well, bring on the tau/dar and others.... I've got a couple of new toys to try out...... heheheheheheh!!!!! But still can't wait for the ork codex BTW.....

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Re: Rumour round up.

Post by Captain-Shawn » Sun Apr 13, 2014 10:14 pm

Won't Krell's Leadership count as Leadership 10 due to him being in the unit with Creed, and he'd be substituting his leadership for Creed's? Or am I thinking of this incorrectly. Either way I think Creed's still pretty nice though for mass infantry, as he saves you vox caster points since he forces re-rolls anyway. Otherwise he really isn't as nice as he was before. Really confused as to why the Hydra lost the ignore jink ability. Taking one isn't awful as it's still cheaper than a Aegis + Quad Gun, but anyone short of Mechanized armies are going to most likely be taking an Aegis anyway.

Chimeras are still really solid, the point bump was more than justified since now we can fire at 4 different targets (5 if an Enginseer shows them a little love). You're go-to APC, and with cheaper vehicle upgrades I am actually paying the same point cost for them, but gaining more anti-infantry power. Not bad. I'll take the lose of 3 fire points for that, 2 were always lasguns anyway. Honestly the Taroux is extremely unappealing compared to what you get from the Chimera. Also considering how cheap it is for Valkyries to take Mutli-Rocket Pods, and even the 10 point reduction on HBs, they can make a good transport that can chop up infantry. This is particularly useful for Melta-Squads. Vendettas are more balanced, compared to other fliers it stands up well.

Primaris Psykers are almost an auto-include, as they are extremely potent buff supports and being IC you can put them in larger blobs for safe keeping (also a nice leadership bump for 50 Conscripts). Ministorum Priests are nice cheap ways to get Plasma Guns into units. Enginseers are an auto include so long as you have atleast one Leman Russ. 1 Point Boltguns please me. That fact any Sergeant short of the Scions can take them further pleases me. Having to remodel all my veteran sergeants to have Boltguns instead of Bolt Pistols doesn't please me. Contemplating getting magnets to magnetize the Boltguns/pistols.

For all my fear, the only thing I'm disappointed about is we lost a significant amount of characters (was hoping for rework and balance of Castonne) and Rough Riders still can't be taken in All-Comer lists. The Executioner suffering Gets Hot! hurts my soul, it's point cost reduction is nice but still it can wreck itself. Probably going to field one still since it puts out some nice Anti-MEQ and Monster power. I'm curious though, would Prescience allow you to re-roll the Gets Hot and Scatter dice?
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Re: Rumour round up.

Post by Arnathos » Mon Apr 14, 2014 1:09 am

Yeah, for the points you save with price reduction, you can exactly afford a primaris psyker in addition to a executioner with plasma cannon sponsons. If you squadron 3 of them and add the psyker you are still like 100 points cheaper off than the last book, but they now re-roll gets hot and scatter.
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Re: Rumour round up.

Post by Captain-Shawn » Mon Apr 14, 2014 1:56 am

That would be pretty deadly! A Wyrdvance squad may be bettered suited to this task, as it's technically 5 wounds the enemy has to chew through before you lose that power. Though leadership 8 isn't fantastic for Psyker powers, so the Primaris would be more reliable than them. I do like the idea of having Wyrdvance psykers buffing up a unit like Conscripts where giving them Prescience is nice, but it won't be detrimental if you don't get it. After all, they're just walking lasguns!
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