SM–Advise on army

Talk about all the armies of the Imperium here, from the mighty Space Marines to the innumerable Astra Militarum.
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TheOddOne
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SM–Advise on army

Post by TheOddOne » Tue May 22, 2018 2:53 am

Hi, I would like some advise on what to do with the last points in this army and what to take for Relics.

Battalion Detatchment

HQ
Captain in Terminator armour–Storm Bolter, Relic Blade (Warlord: Storm of Fire)
Librarian in Terminator armour–Storm Bolter, Force Stave (Null Zone, the other changes after enemy)

Troops
Intercessors 5 men–Stalker Bolt Rifles
Tacticals 5 men–Missile Launcher; chainsword, melta bombs and Bolt pistol on Sgt.
Tacticals 5men–Flamer, combi–flamer, melta bombs


Fast Attack
Bikes 3 men–melta gun, plasma gun, plasma pistol
Assault Squad 5 men–Jump packs, 2 plasma pistols, eviscerator; Plasma pistol, Lightning claw, combat shield and melta bombs on Sgt.
1 Land Speeder–heavy bolter, typhoon missile launcher


Vanguard Detatchment


HQ
2 lieutenants, 1 with storm bolter and power axe, 1 with plasma pistol and power sword


Elites
Company Vets: 2 power fists, 1 plasma gun, 1 grav gun, 1 grav pistol, 1 combi–flamer, 1 combi–melta, 1 power sword
Venerable Dreadnought , Dreadnought CCW, heavy flamer, Assault Cannon
Company Ancient: power fist
Company Champion
Apothecry

Total points: 1625, 9 CP

Ronin
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Re: SM–Advise on army

Post by Ronin » Tue May 22, 2018 11:51 am

Welcome to the forums! Do you have in mind a chapter tactic to run?

coldsteel
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Re: SM–Advise on army

Post by coldsteel » Tue May 22, 2018 12:13 pm

I would not go different special weapons on the Bike squadron. Also, I'd bulk up that squad and the Tacticals.
Crucifiers (SM codex) (11881/703 PL)
Orks (3745/255 PL)
Astra Militarum (####/378 PL)
Fallen Crucifiers (CSM codex) (####/351 PL)
Khornate Daemons (####/65 PL)
Death Guard (2387/128 PL)
Primaris Marines (1099/60 PL)

TheOddOne
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Re: SM–Advise on army

Post by TheOddOne » Wed May 23, 2018 2:11 am

I'm thinking of Salamanders or White Scars.

Ronin
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Re: SM–Advise on army

Post by Ronin » Wed May 23, 2018 4:26 pm

What's your general battle plan? A lot of 40k is dependent on your ability not only to destroy your opponent, but also exert as much board control for as long as you can. I would recommend dividing your forces into three layers like you would in a soccer game: Forwards, midfields, and defense. I would also design your list so that every element can support each other as much as it can. For example, you could have long ranged devastators to support the forward attacking units by softening up targets close to them and allowing the forwards to finish them off. The other thing to watch out for is how you've got a sprinkle of vehicles in a sea of infantry which your opponent could exploit by focus firing their anti tank on and taking them out really easily. I typically prefer to go either all infantry or all vehicle because it saturates take all comer lists with targets and forces them to spread their firepower rather than put everything in one target for a super easy kill. It also allows you to focus fire on the things that can hurt you the most and deal with the rest later.

Here's some suggestions I would do if I wanted to further optimize the list:
Captain in Terminator armour–Storm Bolter, Relic Blade (Warlord: Storm of Fire)
Librarian in Terminator armour–Storm Bolter, Force Stave (Null Zone, the other changes after enemy)
Inceptors would be a fantastic unit to drop with these guys. If you take storm of fire, that's rerolling hits of 1 (or all hits if you upgrade him to a chapter master) and then an additional AP-1 on wounds of 6s. Alternatively are a big pack of shooty terminators which could take advantage of that -1AP. You could screen them with the assault marines too.
Troops
Intercessors 5 men–Stalker Bolt Rifles
Stalker bolters are actually really meh. Bolt rifles are more cost effective and they have the rapid fire option.
Tacticals 5 men–Missile Launcher; chainsword, melta bombs and Bolt pistol on Sgt.
I don't recommend mixing the short ranged melta bombs and bolt pistol with the missile launcher. They're much better off sticking to being only ranged and camping in the back. Missile launchers aren't the best heavy weapon to go with this edition, but if you can't swap out the model, then that's ok. I personally prefer either lascannons or plasma cannons (only if you have a way of rerolling hits)
Tacticals 5men–Flamer, combi–flamer, melta bombs
Flamers aren't that great this edition and you'd need some way of getting them close to be really useful. Drop pods or the other transports are highly recommended because they're not going to shoot much at all. Alternatively, you could go with plasma/combi-plasma, but again only if you can secure reroll hits of 1's somehow.

Fast Attack
Bikes 3 men–melta gun, plasma gun, plasma pistol
This squad might be a priority target because you don't have any meat shields between the special weapons and the enemy fire. I'd also only run them with plasmas if you can get reroll hits of 1's since you always want to overcharge. Otherwise, meltaguns and combi-meltas are your best bet. I also feel they'd be eliminated really quickly if they end up being overextending further than the rest of your army.
Assault Squad 5 men–Jump packs, 2 plasma pistols, eviscerator; Plasma pistol, Lightning claw, combat shield and melta bombs on Sgt.
It sounds counter intuitive, but you definitely don't want any special close combat weapons on any of these models because they don't have enough attacks to make up for it. On vanguard veterans they're more worth it, but assault marines only have 1 attacks or 2 on the sergeant. However, plasma pistols do wonders especially if they're deep striking with the captain. I'd keep them cheap and just run chainswords and plasma pistols.
1 Land Speeder–heavy bolter, typhoon missile launcher
Good loadout, but in a sea of infantry, this might get focus fired on by anti tank.

Vanguard Detatchment


HQ
2 lieutenants, 1 with storm bolter and power axe, 1 with plasma pistol and power sword
Not sure why you really need a second lieutenant on foot. If you plan on deep striking the captain and another unit of deep strikers, you should run one lieutenant with a jump pack. The other one should stick close to your midfielders.

Elites
Company Vets: 2 power fists, 1 plasma gun, 1 grav gun, 1 grav pistol, 1 combi–flamer, 1 combi–melta, 1 power sword
I'd drop these guys. They're a big point sink and an easy target for first blood.
Venerable Dreadnought , Dreadnought CCW, heavy flamer, Assault Cannon
I'd fallback to the storm bolter with this one since you're planning on walking it across the field and keeping it for mid ranged shooting. Again, be careful that it gets focus fired on by anti tank.
Company Ancient: power fist
I don't feel this model would synergize with your army well. I run one since he's surrounded by a big bubble of midfield infantry, but you don't really have that big of a presence.
Company Champion
Apothecry
Flavor units which I include more for fluff, but if you want to optimize, you probably won't need them.

Easy recommendation to start is to run some heavy deep striking unit that can work with the rerolls of the captain. Inceptors, deep striking terminators, more assault marines, and vanguard veterans could be suitable options. Next is to flesh out your midfield and defensives so that you're able to sit on objectives and score points when you draw the tactical objective. I personally would drop every vehicle and possibly the bikes too you have and just go all infantry, but it's up to you if you want to go that route for improved efficiency or gamble on your opponent possibly popping the land speeder or dreadnought early.

TheOddOne
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Re: SM–Advise on army

Post by TheOddOne » Fri May 25, 2018 4:12 pm

So a good next buy is a Stormraven and a couple of Rhinos, if I get it right?

Ronin
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Re: SM–Advise on army

Post by Ronin » Fri May 25, 2018 5:34 pm

It really depends on if that's the play style you want to go for. An all mechanized list can be very effective especially with triple predators throwing kill shot down range and you focus firing on any anti tank that can hurt your army. Problem is you'll be heavily cutting into your infantry and there's folks who can hard counter tanks easily either by taking more anti tank or by simply assaulting them. If you have a local group of folks, I'd gague what they're bringing and see if they tend to be more anti infantry or anti tank. Ultimately, it's your army and unless you're a tournament player with enough disposable income to switch armies every month, you should go with rule of cool since editions and updates will see things rise and fall.

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