What about wounding a squadmember

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Wiouds
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What about wounding a squadmember

Post by Wiouds » Tue Oct 04, 2011 10:20 pm

What if we have there is an attack that wounds a squad member?

Where a wounded Squad member is on the field and can fight but a reduce value. A wound member slows the squad down so their movement is slower and there could be something like for every two wounded squad member you must reduce current offense by 1.

Let some beast unit have a range wounding ability.

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saltinerunner45
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Re: What about wounding a squadmember

Post by saltinerunner45 » Wed Oct 05, 2011 7:55 am

just like a special rule? id call it venom or toxin: if an attack with (venom/toxin) is successful, the defending squad becomes 'poisoned'. a 'poisoned' squad suffers a -1 modifier to their 'WS' and 'BS' (and may only move 1/2 of there regular movement?)
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DacoTrilar
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Re: What about wounding a squadmember

Post by DacoTrilar » Wed Oct 05, 2011 10:42 am

I like it, seems like a interesting weapon type

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slaughtergames
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Re: What about wounding a squadmember

Post by slaughtergames » Wed Oct 05, 2011 10:42 am

well somewhere dacotrilar mentioned a similar idea that i really liked: (and it's pretty much what you're talking about here)
if a model get's "wounded" it survives until the end of it's next activation, so that it can still attack back (yeah this was designed for CC) with some debuffs/disadvantages though...

and i would bring in that a "wounded" model can not join a charge since it is pretty weakened.
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slaughtergames
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Re: What about wounding a squadmember

Post by slaughtergames » Wed Oct 05, 2011 10:45 am

but i don't know whether that should either be a special weapon type or unit special rule?

depending on how we make this it can be an advantage or a disadvantage..
(stoic hero/block on your leg)
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DacoTrilar
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Re: What about wounding a squadmember

Post by DacoTrilar » Wed Oct 05, 2011 10:49 am

we could just call it a status effect on a unit, which says they have some number of wounded models:

Unit has X Wounded models:
-X to all stats (basically some penalty)

if you end your activation in combat with enemy models, then remove all wounded models from the unit.

That combines both rules into one, if people think that makes things easier.

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slaughtergames
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Re: What about wounding a squadmember

Post by slaughtergames » Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:14 am

nah, i would only give the "wounded" models a penalty... but i can understand that you (and matt) want squads to keep functioning as a whole...
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Re: What about wounding a squadmember

Post by DacoTrilar » Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:22 am

slaughtergames wrote:nah, i would only give the "wounded" models a penalty... but i can understand that you (and matt) want squads to keep functioning as a whole...
Well, I see it as a core mechanic in the game. Also, if you only gave wounded models a penalty then you would have squads made up of a mix of different units (wounded models and unwounded models have different stat lines). How would you handle that?

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slaughtergames
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Re: What about wounding a squadmember

Post by slaughtergames » Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:29 am

yeah you're right, i just thought it seemed weird, but it's ok.

so is the penalty going to be linear? (wounds=penalty)
could turn out pretty harsh.

wait, let me think out loud:
3 wounded models = -3 shooting skill and -3CC skill. our "test unit" would be at -1 skill. (both of em) which means.... 3 less hits? that seems alright, but then, if you removed three models as "dead", you would also have 3 less hits.. maybe you lose a point of skill for every two wounded models?
"i buy me new deffkopta!!"
"waaaagh!"
"i did research, to find out how to minimize the randomness of the shock-attack gun."
"huh?"
"waaaagh!"
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Re: What about wounding a squadmember

Post by DacoTrilar » Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:33 am

slaughtergames wrote:yeah you're right, i just thought it seemed weird, but it's ok.

so is the penalty going to be linear? (wounds=penalty)
could turn out pretty harsh.

wait, let me think out loud:
3 wounded models = -3 shooting skill and -3CC skill. our "test unit" would be at -1 skill. (both of em) which means.... 3 less hits? that seems alright, but then, if you removed three models as "dead", you would also have 3 less hits.. maybe you lose a point of skill for every two wounded models?
Yeah, wounded=penalty could be too strong. We could do wounded = 2*penalty like you suggested, which is better as long as we round wounded up. So,

1 wounded = 1 penalty
2 wounded = 1 penalty
3 wounded = 2 penalty
4 wounded = 2 penalty
5 wounded = 3 penalty
6 wounded = 3 penalty
etc...

I like that idea better

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slaughtergames
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Re: What about wounding a squadmember

Post by slaughtergames » Wed Oct 05, 2011 5:30 pm

yup, that's definetly better, otherwise we could just aswell remove "wounded" models as casualties.

but when DO models get removed as casualty? when all models in the unit have been wounded? or we could make it so that you spread it out as you choose... either remove a wounded guy or wound another one... but then units do get more survivable.... i think this should maybe just be the "stoic" special rule or something...
"i buy me new deffkopta!!"
"waaaagh!"
"i did research, to find out how to minimize the randomness of the shock-attack gun."
"huh?"
"waaaagh!"
"WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGH!!"

Wiouds
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Re: What about wounding a squadmember

Post by Wiouds » Wed Oct 05, 2011 6:18 pm

I like the ideal that the can choose to kill with their wounding ability or wound another. Another way that a wounder character could be remove is by healing/repairing the wounded squad member.

When I say wounded I am thinking of the guy that got shoot in the leg and need still fight but need the help of a squad member to move.

Edit to add:

I like the ideal of the penalty be 1 + int((wounds - 1) / step)
Where the int stand for getting the whole number and step is the number you want to go become increasing by 1. So you want for every 2 wounds the unit get 1 penalty then the step will be 2.

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Re: What about wounding a squadmember

Post by DacoTrilar » Wed Oct 05, 2011 9:54 pm

Wiouds wrote:I like the ideal of the penalty be 1 + int((wounds - 1) / step)
Where the int stand for getting the whole number and step is the number you want to go become increasing by 1. So you want for every 2 wounds the unit get 1 penalty then the step will be 2.
I don't understand this at all, but it sounds right :/
slaughtergames wrote: but when DO models get removed as casualty? when all models in the unit have been wounded? or we could make it so that you spread it out as you choose... either remove a wounded guy or wound another one... but then units do get more survivable...
So, I saw this as two things:

First, it's something that occurs in melee when a unit X gets attacked. Instead of taking casualties, unit X take wounded. Those wounded are then removed after unit X's activation. This is simply an idea for how melee could work.

Second, it's a special rule for some weapons which cause wounded instead of casualties. We could implement a rule that if a wounded model is wounded then it is removed as a casualty, however I don't think that regular attacks will cause wounding (this is how I read your post, sorry if I miss read it). Also, I suggest that wounded models should be removed automatically in melee as the furious combat is too much for them to handle. I like this idea as it gives the animal faction a nice one-two punch, as this would make wounded units extremely easy to destroy in melee.

Those are my thoughts on it...

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slaughtergames
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Re: What about wounding a squadmember

Post by slaughtergames » Thu Oct 06, 2011 4:41 pm

@wiouds: well sorry mate i didn't understand that either....

yes but i meant "what if everyone in the unit is wounded?" you can't keep on wounding everybody..

is it like 2-wound models in 40k (with wound-allocation cheese) that everybody get's wounded before somebody dies?

and me might add a random factor in: what kind of wound... (like 40k vehicle rules?)
shot through the legg= movement penalty
shto through arm=skill penalty
shot through head=instant death.(?) (gives a nice anti-character ability for special weapons)

that last one is optional......
"i buy me new deffkopta!!"
"waaaagh!"
"i did research, to find out how to minimize the randomness of the shock-attack gun."
"huh?"
"waaaagh!"
"WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGH!!"

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slaughtergames
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Re: What about wounding a squadmember

Post by slaughtergames » Sat Oct 08, 2011 4:39 pm

but maybe that is more a sniper ability rather than the whole wound thing we are discussing.?

a strait, undefined wound should just be a penalty to something....
"i buy me new deffkopta!!"
"waaaagh!"
"i did research, to find out how to minimize the randomness of the shock-attack gun."
"huh?"
"waaaagh!"
"WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGH!!"

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