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 Post subject: Was this battle unfair?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 4:50 am 
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Recently I have been trying to get my younger brother into wargaming namely warhammer fantasy as that is my preffered system. I even went to the extent of buying and making a battalion box for him along with the skaven contents of the Island of Blood box set ( I had them spare as I bought the box set to expand my High Elves which I have been playing for three years.) This morning I decided to give him a friendly introduction to the rules as being only 11 he wasn't willing to read the rule book no matter how much I have tried to persuade him. I brought forward my high elf army of:

1 unit of 10 phoenix guard

1 unit of 10 swordmaster of hoeth

1 unit of 5 shadow warriors

1 noble

1 level 2 wizard with high magic

Then I allowed him to use his entire army wich consisted of:

4 units of 20 clanrats with poisoned wind morter and warpfire thrower attachments respectively

2 rat ogres with master moulder

1 chieften

1 unit of 10 stormvermin

1 level 2 warplock engineer

I then set up the terrain in his favour giving him a wall to protect any unit he wanted and a few hill to provide better firing points (not overly important but I was making the best of my limited terrain selection)

I then decided to play the heroic last stand scenario with him even increasing the turns I needed to survive to win to 10.

I explained how he could recycle his units and then the battle began with me getting first turn.

I didn 't do much movement wise
In my magic phase I cast flames of the phoenix on one of his clanrat units he failed to dispel it and 5 died

This was where the complaining started

He began to say that I had cheated and I wasn't playing fairly I tried to explain the rule to him but in the end he just sat down with a sour face and told me to continue grumbling the whole time that it was unfair.

In my shooting I failed to do any damage and of course he was the first to laugh when my arrows missed or failed to wound.

There was no close combat so onto his turn 1

He moved or marched everything up

Rolled double 1's for magic and as I began to say how much bad luck that was as I normally do when playing against people he took it for gloating, told me to shut up and sat down with a sour face demanding a reroll.

After 5 minutes of this I caved he rerolled and to my surprise he again got a double 1. I couldn't contain my laughter at this point as events like this in my other games ften caused the entire stores attention to be brought upon the table for a few moments. He of course thought I was mocking him and began shouting saying that the game was unfair and he didn't want to play it if this was what happened.

His shooting phase involed him killing 4 phoenix guard and wounding my mage with the poisoned wind mortor of course to his woops of glee. I at this point was trying not to start yelling at him for not realizing how good sportsmanship worked but kept it in as the nearest gaming store is 3 hours away and I very rarely get a chance to play thus the reason I wanted to get him playing.

This general pattern continued with his failures leading to threats of quitting and his triumphs resulting in a very "in your face" attitude.

My phoenix guard were down to five men by turn 5 and had just managed to whittle down a unit of 20 clanrats down to 3 at this point he was really annoyed at my units surviving so long and started saying that if I didn't die in this round of close combat he didn't want to play. I began to explain even if I failed all my ward saves he didn't have enough attacks to kill me.

He simply went beserk at this point yelling at me saying the I had been cheating this whole time and how this game was so unfair when I asked him why he just repeated because it is so unfair unable to give me a reason. He then stormed off knocking over some of my delicated terrain breaking it and leaving me to clean up the battle.

What do you guys think? Did I stack the battle in my favour?

Should I try and get him playing again or will I just leave him?

Thanks for any help


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:15 am 
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I'm surprised you managed to maintain your cool. I'm surprised at 11 he's still got a very this isn't fair I won't play attitude but then everyone's different:P If anything it was stacked in HIS favour with the terrain and his army so his bad luck shouldn't dissuade him from playing. Keep trying just make sure he agrees to read the rules :P

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:07 am 
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From the way his attitude is, I wouldnt even bother for a while. I think he needs to mature a bit before he gets into this hobby. He probably plays video games where basically it is impossible to die and does nothing but win, win, win and cant accept failure.

It really sucks that your nearest lgs is so far away and that you do want to get your brother involved. But honestly... I wouldnt have the patience for it and would give him a few years. Imagine if he did get into the hobby and acted like this all the time? Basically it would turn into him watching your games because no one would want to play against him and may also reflect negatively on yourself.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 10:59 am 
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It was fair in a sense of a trial game, your brother still seems too immature to grasp the full logic of the game but with luck and practice that may fall away to friendly competition instead. Just keep at it :)

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 1:02 pm 
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Fantasy is a lot more tactical than 40k and there are a lot of opportunities to become confused. Your brother just needs time to adjust to the rules and perhaps a little more maturity to cope with bad rolling (the dice gods are not forgiving).

If you are set on getting him into the game i'd leave him be til he's a little older/more mature and then stack the game so that you are royally screwed. If he steamrolls you a time or two he might get hooked. then when he gets better you can throw away any notion of mercy.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 1:16 pm 
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Also, in a way... get used to it!
Ive played alot of people who are all: "Ima charge and kill you, chomp chomp" (someone acually said that to me), my response is always "In theory", than they fail the charge and pout.
people talk the talk, and I let them, keeping my mouth shut. Its a game, sometimes its random, so just "roll with it". I always keep my mouth shut, as it can be random... I rolled 10 ones in a row once! In a tourney! it was painful, but taught me, to shut up and just roll!!!!!

Maybe 40k would be more his thing.... basically build the best list and you win.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 4:12 pm 
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I don't get why people spam small units of rats for warp fire throwers, it never works well for me.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:17 pm 
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Flindo wrote:
I don't get why people spam small units of rats for warp fire throwers, it never works well for me.

Because that was helpful to the original question. :roll:

Anyway, let your brother grow up a bit more. He just doesn't seem to be mentally or emotionally ready to play fantasy or any other game with an aspect of chance or tactics. After a year or so try again -shrugs-

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 1:07 pm 
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I think if you brother did get into the hobby and played games with other people then yourself at clubs, stores etc he would be hated with that attitude. I personally played a guy who told me i was cheating one miniture then when i missed with a lascannon he litrally got into my face laughing and telling me how useless i was. After that nobody wanted to play him as like most people i play they play for the enjoyment and to take note on what to do better next time. I no its your brother but i would let him play the hard way and see how he goes. You did the right thing getting him into wargaming but i think he needs to grow up and understand thats it a game not a battle to see who soul will go into the warp lol :lol:

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 12:47 pm 
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So, just my opinion here, but I think, yes, it was unfair in your favor. Why? You went ahead and played without him having read the rules. Yep, his choice, but you should have said, "Well, until you read the rules, you can't play." Otherwise, to him, it's going to seem like you're just doing things as you please. Plus, you're not giving him a chance to prove himself to be mature.

I think on top of that, you shouldn't have built the army for him. It only lends to the idea that he's going to just have things handed to him. Not the right attitude to foster.

You should work with him to build models from the sprue up. Encourage him there. Talk about the units. Invite him to games and explain what's happening. You start doing those kinds of things, and you'll figure out very quickly whether he really has an interest and/or the maturity to go further with it.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:52 am 
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As everyone ones said it was stacked in your favour not his.
My younger brother was never sooo bad but he did qing a bit when i won or got lucky roles.

Get your brother into the modeling/painting aspect if you can
The bring him into the games.
Thats what i did and now he enjoys warhammer games and all the rest that comes with it

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2012 8:36 am 
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Im 14 so Im about the same age as your bro and Im really immature (not in the sulky way) but even I dont think I'd wanna play with him. My first game was with the AoBR box at a GW store and I played orks and steam rolled the guy that was teaching me, it was fun.

3 hours away dayuuum and I thought I had to travel far, I have a few clubs and gaming stores around none more than 45 minutes to an hour and a few pretty close by about 20 minutes away so I must be spoiled for choice.

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