combat fleeing/pursuing

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teclis
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combat fleeing/pursuing

Postby teclis » Fri Feb 17, 2012 7:23 am

one question - if the enemy is beaten and fails it break test, does it flee on a route center_of_my_unit - center_of_his_unit?

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Re: combat fleeing/pursuing

Postby Azeebo » Fri Feb 17, 2012 7:58 am

He flees directly away from the unit he was in combat with.

If there are multiple units in combat, and you fail you flee directly from the unit with the most ranks...this could in theroy make you flee towards the enemies board edge...which is really bad for you ^^
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Re: combat fleeing/pursuing

Postby Todda » Fri Feb 17, 2012 8:34 am

...Then the next turn if they fail to rally they flee toward you own table edge.

Typically the units should have closed ranks and be flat to each other and pretty much centered, so you should just need to turn 180' and flee. Also remember if there are more than one unit, particularly on the side or rear, they will simply flee through them. When you roll to pursue, even though these units are closer, you still need to roll higher than what they rolled and if you do not, but the distance rolled moves you too close, you need to stop 1" away. Also if you roll higher but pursue into another enemy unit you still destroy broken unit as they turn to flee basically then hit the other unit. Make sure to maximize contact just like a normal charge.
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Re: combat fleeing/pursuing

Postby Azeebo » Fri Feb 17, 2012 11:23 am

With my Goblins i always found it amusing to break an enemy in their turn (if possible), have them flee in an awkward direction then hit them with a random movement unit like Squig Hoppers. Enemies cannot use any charge reactions which includes FLEE, this means the unit is instantly destroyed.

Have dont it a few times in the past, and it is just horrid to see an unlucky unit break and get destroyed by a tiny unit of hoppers ^_^ Works with doom wheels and what not.
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Re: combat fleeing/pursuing

Postby Todda » Fri Feb 17, 2012 8:21 pm

A unit already can not flee again. They die! (p23) Same if you overrun into a broken unit. (p58) Only an unbroken unit can flee as a charge response. A broken unit can do nothing.
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Re: combat fleeing/pursuing

Postby Zero » Sat Feb 18, 2012 4:37 am

Todda wrote:A unit already can not flee again. They die! (p23) Same if you overrun into a broken unit. (p58) Only an unbroken unit can flee as a charge response. A broken unit can do nothing.

I thought broken units automatically fled, and if you caught them they were destroyed. I may have to check the rulebook again.
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Re: combat fleeing/pursuing

Postby Azeebo » Sat Feb 18, 2012 5:17 am

I was also under the impression that if you charged a fleeing unit they automatically fled again. Unless they can only flee once per turn i dunno. ^^
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Re: combat fleeing/pursuing

Postby Zero » Sat Feb 18, 2012 5:45 am

Azeebo wrote:I was also under the impression that if you charged a fleeing unit they automatically fled again. Unless they can only flee once per turn i dunno. ^^

That's what I thought...
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Re: combat fleeing/pursuing

Postby Arnathos » Sat Feb 18, 2012 8:11 am

It's all there on page 17 of the BRB. under flee:
BRB wrote:A Flee! reaction is not always voluntary - fleeing units must always declare a Flee! reaction.


Oh and I also did some more reading and I cannot find anything that limits the amount of flee reactions, basically this would mean you could flee all the way across the board as a fleeing unit must keep declaring flee reactions. This might have been FAQ'd but it should also be noted that the fleeing unit always flees away from the chargers/pursuers, so you could chase them off the table with some well positioned units.

Although I would think they would limit the movement to 1 per turn, otherwise units could just declare bogus charges forcing the unit to flee insane distances.
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Re: combat fleeing/pursuing

Postby Todda » Sat Feb 18, 2012 9:00 am

p23... CHARGING A FLEEING ENEMY
If, for whatever reason, a unit completes a charge against a fleeing unit, move the charging unit(s) into contact with the fleeing enemy as described earlier and then the fleeing unit is run down by the chargers. Remove the entire unit as casualties.


At no point do they ever say to make another flee movement. They are destroyed. The same happens if you pursue/overrun into a fleeing unit. This is another reason to have a unit in the flank or back. If a unit takes by choice or is forced to Flee as a charge reaction another closer unit can then charge it and wipe it out. They do not get to flee again... That was in the old rules and 40k. You only get one Flee reaction and once fleeing you are done. This also make since as a fleeing unit has no defenses ready and are even less likely to know about another charge...
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Re: combat fleeing/pursuing

Postby Arnathos » Sat Feb 18, 2012 10:27 am

But what about page 17? Under the Flee! charge reaction. I'll try to be specific this time:
You'll normally want to declare a Flee! reaction if you think that your unit has no chance of surviving the ensuing fight. A Flee! Reaction is not always voluntary - units that are already fleeing must declare a Flee! reaction, and certain terrifying creatures may force an otherwise steady unit to Flee! instead of other options.


from the bit I bolded out on page 17 I assume they do flee. However, if they do flee, AND you catch them afterwards, which page 23 refers to then yes, they die.

This is how I understand it, could be wrong, and the line is hard to spot, took me 30 mins of reading to find it(dyslexia ftw), but it's there.

Also check out charge reaction on page 16.
An enemy unit that has had a charge declared against it must hold or preform a charge reaction - shooting at the chargers or retreating from the threat. Once the charge reaction is complete, the charging player can declare a charge with another unit, until he has declared all the charges he wishes to.


these rules in combination do sort of seem to point out that they can run a whole lot if you say 'boo' often enough. I also read the FAQ, no mention of any exception or limit of only 1 flee move per sub phase, or phase, or even turn. It is new to me as well, but that's what is written.
Last edited by Arnathos on Sat Feb 18, 2012 10:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: combat fleeing/pursuing

Postby Tuomir » Sat Feb 18, 2012 10:32 am

Yep, Todda is wrong in this one, sorry. A fleeing unit always chooses the "flee" charge reaction if charged. Unless, of course, they are not allowed charge reactions, as happens with units with random movement. However, if the unit is caught by the charge, it's destroyed.
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Re: combat fleeing/pursuing

Postby Badger » Sat Feb 18, 2012 11:04 am

Tuomir wrote:Yep, Todda is wrong in this one, sorry. A fleeing unit always chooses the "flee" charge reaction if charged. Unless, of course, they are not allowed charge reactions, as happens with units with random movement. However, if the unit is caught by the charge, it's destroyed.


This ^^^

It sounds strange that you'd flee so many times, but 99% of the time, flee reactions are going to take you far away from the charge lines, so the first time you flee, you're probably going to end up somewhere where you can't have another charge declared at you. You could roll really low for your initial flee I guess, but then, it makes sense that you'd have the time to flee some more inches (assuming you weren't caught). Occasionally you may end up with a weird situation where you have to flee ALOT, but you have to remember the rules are an abstraction of reality, they're not going to work perfectly in every conceivable situation situation.
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Re: combat fleeing/pursuing

Postby Azeebo » Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:05 pm

If you charge a fleeing unit, they MUST flee, if you STILL catch them with your 2D6+M they are then destroyed. This is why you use random movement units like the doom wheel who do not all flee reactions thus you instantly destroy them.

Todda is wrong on this one ^^
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Re: combat fleeing/pursuing

Postby Todda » Sat Feb 18, 2012 4:33 pm

OK... just overrun and random movements auto run down a fleeing unit. I do not really know how to handle a unit being charged by multiple units. It says it must make a Flee charge reaction for each charge, but does that mean just that it can not hold and shoot once it has fled and only makes one actual flee move, or does it flee from every unit that makes a charge... So a unit in front declares a charge it immediately flees 8" away, then a unit behind charges and now it flees again, but now move right back to where it was and gets run down when the unit in front moves.
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