Lore of Death OP?

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BigAxeGod
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Lore of Death OP?

Post by BigAxeGod » Thu Jan 22, 2015 5:28 pm

So I just felt I needed to get this out, I apologize if I'm ranting but I wanted to share my opinion.

Just a couple of hours ago I was playing a friendly doubles game at my local GW it was 1250pts per player and me and my teammate were both running fairly solid ogres lists against a couple of chaos armies.

We were reaching the end of the game and frankly we were dominating. Most of the chaos were diminished thanks to great shooting from our side. I had only lost one Irongut, and my teammate had only lost 2 Mournfang. It couldn't have been going better.

Then the opponent landed an (admittedly well placed) purple sun which killed one of my ironguts, 4 of my leadbelchers, 6 of my partners ogres and his ironblaster...in total almost 700pts of models! and by using that he earned 15 more dice to use for magic meaning he then reduced the strength and toughness of all of our remaining units.

In the end while we still got the victory it was by and extremely narrow margin. Especially considering how much we were dominating before.

I''m sure this lore isn't really OP but I just felt slightly wronged and needed to vent my frustrations.
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halt92
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Re: Lore of Death OP?

Post by halt92 » Thu Jan 22, 2015 6:02 pm

Death is a VERY strong lore against Ogres as Purple Sun kills most units on a 3+ ignoring their wounds. The Ogres also have a low leadership making character sniping a very real threat.

Conversely though Death is almost useless against armies such as Warriors of Chaos and any Elves as they have a very good Initiative in general and a good leadership value on their Lord Options.

I honestly think that test and remove spells are unhealthy to the game as a whole because not everyone has access (which makes some armies less viable) and most times you can't even dispel when they throw 6 dice and miscast every. single. time. (I'm looking at you Dweller/Throne combo)

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Re: Lore of Death OP?

Post by Hedonismbot » Thu Jan 22, 2015 9:16 pm

BigAxeGod wrote:So I just felt I needed to get this out, I apologize if I'm ranting but I wanted to share my opinion.

Just a couple of hours ago I was playing a friendly doubles game at my local GW it was 1250pts per player and me and my teammate were both running fairly solid ogres lists against a couple of chaos armies.

We were reaching the end of the game and frankly we were dominating. Most of the chaos were diminished thanks to great shooting from our side. I had only lost one Irongut, and my teammate had only lost 2 Mournfang. It couldn't have been going better.

Then the opponent landed an (admittedly well placed) purple sun which killed one of my ironguts, 4 of my leadbelchers, 6 of my partners ogres and his ironblaster...in total almost 700pts of models! and by using that he earned 15 more dice to use for magic meaning he then reduced the strength and toughness of all of our remaining units.

In the end while we still got the victory it was by and extremely narrow margin. Especially considering how much we were dominating before.

I''m sure this lore isn't really OP but I just felt slightly wronged and needed to vent my frustrations.
I feel for ya. But like Halt said, it's only that bad because that's the perfect counter to your guys. When I've running my vampire counts, I've often had to face off against light coven armies and it's not fun I'm getting my troops nuked without anything I can about it other than take it. Poops happens though.

Good things about that is I'm sure next time you run into a similar situation
you'll spread out your units, so someone won't be able to hit so many of your units.

There are a couple way Imo to handle this though. Dispell scroll is one, if you aren't taking one already for those times when they roll really well on something but don't miscast and there's always the favourite, the hell heart. If somebody knows you have this item, you can make them crap a brick when you get close and it's their magic phase.

Let someone take several wizards and cackle with glee as you basically shut down their magic phase for a turn and often kill or cripple their casters in the process.

I hate that damn thing with a passion!
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BigAxeGod
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Re: Lore of Death OP?

Post by BigAxeGod » Thu Jan 22, 2015 11:28 pm

Haha thanks for the advice. I really should have brought a dispel scroll, it would've helped so much.

Sadly in this particular case it was impossible to spread out my units as we were only playing on a 4'x4' table with 2500pts on each side. So everything was a bit cramped...nightmare situation when that spell comes up.

Basically it was the perfect spell to use on my army, at that particular time. I'm impressed really.

I'm not really angry. I was just so shocked at the moment I felt like I needed to tell someone :P I'll know for next time.
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Re: Lore of Death OP?

Post by Arnathos » Fri Jan 23, 2015 12:29 am

As the others have said, its mostly ogres lizardmen and tomb kings that suffer from the lore of death, aside from purple sun and doom&darkness (or whatever the -1 S&T 24" bubble is called) there aren't that many powerful spells in there.

Also I'm pretty sure you can't have more than 12 power dice at a time, but that can still make magic phases go on forever. I remember my last game with daemons where my Great Unclean one destroyed an entire Tomb Kings army single handedly in just 2 turns, I felt like a terrible person.
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Re: Lore of Death OP?

Post by TigerDave » Sat Jan 24, 2015 11:40 pm

Purple Sun isn't the only "Day Ruiner". Dwellers Below, Final Transformation, Dreaded 13th can all be game ruiners.

My advice: Study the Lores. Make note in your rules book of spells you absolutely cannot allow to go through, and others you can afford to take. Some of the buff/hex spells I choose to let go through automatically and just hope for good generalship/dice rolls. When you know what lore and spells your opponent has, take notes. If they have one of those "Apocalypse" spells, those are the ones you save your dispel dice and scroll for! Sometimes you'll just have to weather the other crap.

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Re: Lore of Death OP?

Post by Hedonismbot » Sun Jan 25, 2015 6:25 pm

BigAxeGod wrote:Haha thanks for the advice. I really should have brought a dispel scroll, it would've helped so much.

Sadly in this particular case it was impossible to spread out my units as we were only playing on a 4'x4' table with 2500pts on each side. So everything was a bit cramped...nightmare situation when that spell comes up.
Damn, that sucks. Though there's silver lining. Such a small board will screw over elf armies, as they'll have no where to run to.
Basically it was the perfect spell to use on my army, at that particular time. I'm impressed really.
If they didn't say Haduken while casting, then they're doing it wrong! :lol:
I'm not really angry. I was just so shocked at the moment I felt like I needed to tell someone :P I'll know for next time.
Arnathos wrote:As the others have said, its mostly ogres lizardmen and tomb kings that suffer from the lore of death, aside from purple sun and doom&darkness (or whatever the -1 S&T 24" bubble is called) there aren't that many powerful spells in there.

Also I'm pretty sure you can't have more than 12 power dice at a time, but that can still make magic phases go on forever. I remember my last game with daemons where my Great Unclean one destroyed an entire Tomb Kings army single handedly in just 2 turns, I felt like a terrible person.
I wouldn't say that. Aside from aspect of the spirit leech(because who takes dreadknight) each thing has it's place. I just feel that you often need to chain combo them to get really get something to work, such as casting doom and darkness then spirit leech, or go with soul blight, then either caress of laniph or fate of bijuna in that order. Also depends or the army using it Imo.

For my vamps/undead legions for examle, it's really gross when paired with vampire ld debuffing auras and then screams

With the exception a couple undead end times characters, I believe you're right. They can store some extra dice in their staves which they can then later use for themselves, regardless of what one rolls for winds of magic.
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