Guard vs Necrons Season 2 Episode 14 Video Response to Comments

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Guard vs Necrons Season 2 Episode 14 Video Response to Comments

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Comments: 1 to 25 of 110

scaryscarymushroom (4 months ago):

Oh, and Matt?

Thanks for posting this reply.

scaryscarymushroom (4 months ago):

I feel I should add more.

If your opponent always fields a squad of long fangs or GK purifiers (something cheesy), because the cheese works well for him, then he should expect me to create a list tailored against the cheese.

There's only so many times a person can play against the same army list over and over again without figuring out ways to min-max in order to level the playing field.

It's a part of how 40k is played.

In one-off and pickup games, I do think it's unsportsmanlike to look at your opponent's list and say "oh, he has 3 tervigons and the doom a bunch of basic termagants, and nothing else? I know how to handle this!" It's another thing entirely to know that you're opponent has access to a few venomthrope models, some genestealers, 3 tervigons, the doom, a hive tyrant, some biovores, and lots of hormagaunts and termagants of which he will use 1500 points; and then build a list based on that.

Just like it's unsportsmanlike to tailor against specific builds (rather than general builds), I think it's unsportsmanlike to bring something to the table that your opponent could never ever ever deal with.

Example: you are fighting salamanders space marines or Sisters of Battle. Lots of meltas and flamers. Limited access to long range weaponry. So you bring a list in which everything can launch an assault from further than 24". That isn't fair. That's unsportsmanlike.

However, if one player isn't playing fair, it's totally fine for another player to not play fair, either.

The salamanders player could throw everything in lascannon-armed razorbacks, and include no flamers or meltas whatsoever. That's min-maxing, and it's also tailoring against armies that rely on fast assault speeds and delicate armor and transports. Equally unsportsmanlike, and the game is made fair.

scaryscarymushroom (4 months ago):

@TheDuke07 & Maverick452: Prizes and monatery incentive have nothing to do with whether or not list tailoring is permissible, and I'm surprised that either of you have positions that are so strong, considering that in order to back up what you're saying, you'd need to see MWG's accounting books...

On the topic of list tailoring, It's a huge part of 40k. Players all over have the right to choose the atmosphere in which they play their games...

My brother plays orks, and has very few models for vehicles. He has no other armies. So, I know what I'm up against every game I play with him. As a consequence, that influences my decisions when I build a list.

So does that mean that I always have the upper hand? No. When we play a 1000 point game, I don't know if he's going to take his only deff dread and a single killa kan, or if he's going to take a squad of 30 'ard boyz, or if he's going to take a bunch of burnas in a battle wagon.

What I do know is that I'll never face more than 1 battle wagon. I'll never face more than 2 trukks.
I'll never face more than 3 nob bikers. I'll probably end up looking at 50+ boys squads, and it's likely that half of them will be 'ard boyz. But I have no idea, within those parameters, what I'm facing until it's too late to change my list.

Still, I build a list that's meant for orks, not a list that's meant for Tau or space marines.

On the other side of the spectrum, you have tournament play, where not only is it unsporting to tailor your list, but it's ineffective.

Beat Matt Batreps are not tournaments. They are competitive, but they have more in common with the one off games I play with my brother than with the tournament scene. Within certain parameters (say, a 2000 point sample from 4500 points of necrons), Matt's opponents know what to expect, and Matt should know basically what to expect in return.

Hena (4 months ago):

I must admit that I haven't played 40k since last edition as that pretty much destroyed the enjoyment in 40k game play. However I do play epic and have my own opinion about list tailoring.

IMO tailoring is awful. We usually have multiple armies per person. The only thing we choose in advance is that armies which both have are chosen as possibilities to one side, so that we don't get same armies on both sides. Other than that we don't know what is the army or what it consists of. This helps to remove the tailoring. I think that armies should be designed to be able to play against any type of opponent.

IMO in beat matt batreps, only rule should be, don't bring Tyranid / Necron armies in similar manner than "what we do"

wargammer (4 months ago):

can u plz make some more Tyradis Batrep they where SO more awesome?

crazy4chaos (4 months ago):

i dont think matt did anything wrong and people do tailoring in 40k thing about is cams list was tailored for necron plus the necron be new there harder to know what to bring. keep up the good work matt \m/

ajree210 (5 months ago):

I don't even think you "tailored" your list at all. All Matt did was recognize his enemy and make adjustments. Sounds like something any decent general would (and should!) do. Plus, Beat Matt Batreps aren't just "beer and pretzels" games. They're competitive games where an opponent is playing to win a prize.

Keep up the great BMB videos, Matt.

TauofMontKa (5 months ago):

Tailoring can okay in my mind if it's two vets doing a game for fun and they just want lots of stuff to die. Otherwise, say a vet v noob tailoring is a no, noob v nob is a no vet v vetfor a competitive game is a no. The actual fluff about tailoring is when the Commander of your army arrived they didn't know what thy were fighting, and only had what they had with them. Yes, that technically means Eldrad could tailor lists, but no. I hope this makes sense

ilan (5 months ago):

I think evrybody does a little bit of tailoring it just part of the game and it's a tactic

nb262 (5 months ago):

i think tailoring is fine

rdubayoo (5 months ago):

Yes, it was list tailoring because he took Scarab Swarms, a unit you should ALWAYS take against any army that relies heavily on tanks.

Give me a break. Why should he cripple himself just to hold himself to some internet troll's arbitrary idea of fairness?

julian12345 (5 months ago):

This...this is stupid.

Tailoring should never be excepted as it makes the game even less skill needed (lol like it had it anyways?) And should be frowned upon as a lack of skill.

TheDuke07 (5 months ago):

@Maverick452: He makes these so he has content for the site to draw people back. This isn't a charity event. the small amount of money he gives away is laughable to what he will make

PowerRang3r (5 months ago):

He also moved forward instead of letting your walking units come to him

Crashgolem (5 months ago):

If you know what you are playing against what is the point of NOT List tailoring ???

KingVoid (5 months ago):

If you know what your up against then of course your going to tailor your army just like in real war generals try to be as prepared as possible. Good game Matt.

bahmin (5 months ago):

don't worry about it (the comments), writing lists is a strange thing because of how much it can influence the game, ultimately its a mix of what you have, what you can and what you're up against, what i do tend to be influenced on who i am playing more or less only knowing what army they have.

i think the fairest way to do lists which i practice myself is to each write you're lists in secret then show just before deployment, yes this runs the risk of being imbalanced but avoids the tailoring, also i don't agree that tyranids are that weak against amour i find genestealers very effective ymgarl being the best with there ability to pop up anywhere and get the plus strength or attacks.

chereki (5 months ago):

I think it was a good batt rep, i realy hope you will do a rematch

keep upp the good work

Maverick452 (5 months ago):

To those that disagree with Matt knowing what the opponent brings;

the prizes he gives away are from his own pocket, because he is the game store owner giving away prizes for beating him. Its not like these people are paying money to try and beat Matt then end up losing due to list tailoring.

Matt is merely asking what they are bringing so he can try out different units and get a feel for what each of the new units/models can do.

Thanks Matt for the continued support to the gaming community with these intuitive and information battle reports that you bring to us week after week!

Looking forward to the newest one!

Ome (5 months ago):

List tailoring isn't bad at all, anyone who says they never do it are lying. But that doesn't mean some Necrons abilities aren't cheese, and that mistakes weren't made and such.

CedricO (5 months ago):

I Personally agree. Tactical mistakes on Cam's part... i also dont understand his obsession with lascannons. in my opinion you dident do anything wrong ... it was a good game.

Krasimirova (5 months ago):

Good reply Matt..

Made good points about your "list Tailoring" and you are correct that it wasn't your list that won the game, but the lack of scarab experience from the IG player..

Again, good work on the battle reports..

O-kais (5 months ago):

it was a fair game and no one is at fualt and list tailoring is fine becuse everyone does it and some just eather do not realise it or do not want to admit they do it.

jeppe (5 months ago):

i don't think you need allcomers all the time, why would GW give you that many different things which they know that some are way better ect.

Cryage (5 months ago):

Exactly as you said Matt, Necrons are new and players are still learning exactly what they do. like all new codex's (even the GK one when it came out) you explain an ability your army can do / a model can do, you'll get the raised eyebrow till you prove it by quoting the codex. I think in about 3 months when the "new stuff" gets played more and people are more aware of the strengths and weaknesses, people will stop complaining.

Good game to both you and Cam, Cam likely will know to not move the tanks up, kill scarabs first, and also keep a line of guardsmen in front of the tanks to avoid the charge from the scarabs

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About this Content

Author: MiniWarGaming
Added: December 21, 2011
Views: 4,028
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Matt responds to comments left on this battle report. Season 2 Episode 14 - Guard vs Necrons.

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